Gary and everyone,

I have been In Asia a longtime and the only pellet gun I had was a toy pump up .177 but it blew out. Got a chance at this one and took it.

I got this .22 CO2 (really .223 more later) at an airgun shop when the very, very, upset Father returned it because his Son used his College money to buy it and being a kid he shot out a picture window the first day. It cost the Son $140 US for the new gun, screw on Moderator, 200 pellets and 4500 PSI full CO2 tank. It came with 11 mm rails but has a peep site that is a rough local copy of Military peep site. The front rail is a real .22 ramp site. I am OK with a peep for testing stage and break in. It has no gauge and fill tank has no gauge. The on board tank is stainless coated but not real stainless.

The Father wanted his money back but that was not going to happen so I asked "How much" The Dad said the new price and I asked if he would take $60 cash now? The Dad said yes. I got out the money and he left the gun, moderator, tank, and a bunch of pellets on the counter and walked out. Deal done, no hand shake, no receipt and the gun has no numbers at all. This was all done in Philippine Peso but these are close to the real values.

About the Gun, it is a local gun made by hand. The Barrel is real .22 firearm barrel that is a reject from the local Firearms Manufacture called Armscorp. If the barrel is damaged they wholesale it and the Pellet gun guy hacks off the bad part and makes a .22 pellet gun.The crown was really good and clean. The local pellets would not shoot in a USA .22 airgun ( too large) and American pellets are too small to shoot well in this gun. So if this gun was in the USA it would be hard to get .223 pellets for it. The pellets we buy here for these guns are very hard lead copies of a basic dome pellet but made here in the Philippines. I have not measured the pellet head but side by side with a JSB you can just see the difference. The gun is too weak to shoot cast pellets of any size and the local pellets work OK for short distances.

This barrel is 16 inches long. The gun is CO2, single shot. The gun is short, I would call it a carbine size gun. The trigger was about 7 lbs, one looooooooong stage and broke clean. This AM I cleaned and shined up the trigger surfaces and found it was binding in the mount and now it is NOT at all heavy and much better. The receiver is brass, the bolt is steel and has double O rings inside and a steel probe. It does not leak down and does not spit or puff air when I shoot it. It cocks pretty hard but locks back solid. Safety??? Ha ha.. Manly Men do not need them. I wish it did have one. I pull the bolt open to make it a bit safer but not safe.

The moderator is a steel tube about 6" long with 7 plastic rings or cone shaped plastic pieces inside held toward the barrel end with a spring. This was pressed together and does not come apart to clean. The pellets do NOT hit it and it seems to cut the sound way down but I would say it is cheap and not a quality one. But they are 100% legal here. The hole in the moderator is way way way larger about .30 much bigger than .223 that is why it is not super quiet.

The stock wood is called Philippine mahogany but could be many types of local hard wood, it is blond and the wood is hard the and finish is one coat of cheap varnish. It has some Beaver teeth marks and some knots in the grain but it fits OK, shoulders really well, has a bit of cheek piece, and has a soft foam butt pad that will rot off in a few months.

I shot it at the airgun store and the pellets have NO weight marked on the box, I do not have a scale to check but my gun at full charge shot them over the store chrono at was just under 700 fps (690fps) average and 60 fps between the first and last shot.

FPE or Power????? I am going to ballpark it 12 fps maybe a bit less. But I will shoot only rats, sparrows, or for fun. I will be pesting in crowded areas and in barns and buildings so low power is good. I will not shoot it over 20 yards so it should be OK for a rat gun.

Overall it is a DANG heavy airgun since the barrel is a real steel gun barrel and fat. I shot two shots in the photo at 15 yards standing and resting on a cement post of the old house. I wanted to shoot more but some guys living across the street wanted to see the gun and talk about the gun. Plus just the two shots touching at 15 yards makes me and gun look great. ha ha

Is this a great gun? NO. It cost $140 new with peep sights, and a moderator. A refill tank costs $20, so this is a $120 CO2 pellet gun and we always get what we pay for. Will it shoot 20 yards and kill rats? I have no doubt of that. Will it shoot 1/2" groups at 50 yards.. NO way in the world. Would I shoot at a live animal at 50 yards? NO. I need a sling and will get a scope soon.

The shot pellet in the photo was shot at 15 yards into a cardboard box and old piece of outdoor carpet folded 4 layers. It passed 2 layers of carpet and has good rifle marks but these are HARD pellets.

CO2 is pain and I wanted a PCP but the price was right. Shot count? The on board tank is good for 15 shots and starts to drop at 10 shots. The big tank in the photo holds 150 shots and costs .75 us cents to fill up. There is a guy less than one mile from me who fills them.

So am I happy? Yes. I wanted a PCP. But a used .22 marauder here costs about $850 to $1000 because they are imported. My wallet will never allow me one of those.

I will post first blood photos after I get a scope.

PHOTOS attached. I had a problem my photos from my phone are 500 in size and the sizer I used made them small I hope you can see them.

Shoot em if you got em.

You can ask me anything. But no they cannot be exported and you can do way better where ever you are .. ha ha

Larry

Hi Larry!

Thanks for posting bi moved it over here for more traffic.

Your rifle looks just fine. I really hope you enjoy it.

Interesting how your builders press everything into service. Find a way. I always admire that.

The pellet head looks long and solid. I wouldn't be surprised if your pellet is 18-20 grains. So, let's see .... Take 19 grains. And you recall the magic number of velocity is 671 fps. At 671 fps, any pellet produces foot pounds of energy equal to the number of grains. Therefore; if your 19 grain pellet goes 671 fps it produces 19 fpe! It's most likely hotter then you think. That should easily shoot thru 1/2" of plywood so be careful. The round solid heads of the pellets will really penetrate too. Not like a short flat head.

If you are really ratting at 10-15 yards, pet the pellet in backwards. Makes a great hollow point and will shoot straight for a distance. Test it.

Thanks for posting Larry. Enjoy!!!

Gary

Gary,

These Pellets are really hard I heard they use wheel weights and old US Military lead from the shotgun range and the regular ranges. I borrowed a scale and I found these pellets are 17.1 average. So 17.1 grains moving at 695 fps is 18.35 Foot Pounds of Energy. Wow that is more than I guessed and a bit more than I need.

We see guys in Europe shooting 50 meters with a sub 12 foot pound guns and making clean kills on rabbits. So at just 15 to 20 yards at rats in a building is really a lot of power for the use.

There are no raccoon, possums, or any animal I can shoot anywhere near that size here.

I had a tiny problem with it the valve or hammer was sticking. I took it back the guy is cool he wanted to add a heavy spring and hammer. I could see it was rough and did not feel slick in my hand, so he allowed me to buff and polish all the valve parts, all the hammer and moving parts, and not change anything. I just let him put it back together and I charged it and shot over the chrono again it went from 690 to 695 average for 5 shots. No more hammer sticking.

Gary I was NOT looking for more power for a barn rat gun this is fine it hits plenty hard for a CO2 gun. A guy brought a real Marauder in to the shop in .22 and it hit way harder than mine ... which is just fine for me.

Today I bought a China made Bushnell scope with a lighted reticle in red and green. it is 3 x 9 and cost 1,799 peso and that converts to $36.44 usd. But I could not find the warranty card any where. ha ha card in the box l

This is a real Bushnell scope made in China but some parts must be out of spec .. but it seems OK and the test shots were OK. More photos tomorrow it is dark here and raining.

At least I am shooting again.

Thanks,

Larry

Tell us about your backward pellet (extreme hollow point) testing.

Have you gone on any barn raids yet?

Gary

Gary,

Shot the backwards local made pellets at 15 yards and they did not shoot keyhole but the holes seemed a bit bigger than forward shot pellets. Since this gun is 18 food pounds or so it makes shooting in straw roofed sheds and light bamboo walls dangerous. So the backwards pellet will really help. Thanks I did not know that.

It has been raining everyday here for last 3 days, about 8 inches so far and expecting more for next few days but I promise to get to the barn and get some pictures too. Going out to a farm now would fill my boots up with yuk and rust my cheap gun.

I will include a few photos with scope mounted with this note. The Moderator's HOLE is a bit over .30 inches all the way down and including the end. So this is not super quiet as I stated before. I got a chance to ask the man who made the whole gun why the Moderator was pressed together because I cannot really clean this one. He asked, "why would anyone want to clean a moderator"? I just smiled and walked away. I was going to ask him why it the moderator hole and baffles were over .30 in size for a .22 but I was afraid to really know his answer.

I changed the local made peep to a China made Bushnell 3 x 9 x 32 EG with lighted reticle in red or green and removed the front sight too. The scope cost 1,799 Philippine pesos or $36.02 Dollars.Using today's conversion rates. It seems to be real, clear, and everything works smooth and easy. It took me only 3 shots at 20 yards to put the pellets right in the center using a table and sandbags. I guess I will let you know how it is in 3 months. ha ha Down side it has no parallax wheel or knob so that is handled with front focus ring. I only shoot on 3 power at 18 yards to 20 yards so I will not have to worry about it. But for walking and stalking rabbits or squirrel hunting it would be a pain. But we have none of those here.

In review the Gun is cheaply made with worn out China parts and tools (except the barrel). The valve is made in Manila and seems to be OK after I took it all apart and buffed and shined every part then let the bench guy assemble while I watched. Every screw and bolt is a hacked off China made one that is too long. I mean he puts it in a vice and uses a saw to cut them almost to size then screws them in without clean up. I had to remove 4 of them and file them down because they were touching moving parts. I will replace them all when I can get to Manila to buy some quality ones. I had to loctight the ones holding the valve in the action the tapped hole was too big and they backed out as I shot it. Scary. But paying $1000 U.S. for a used Marauder here is not an option for me. So I got what I paid for and I am OK with it.

It is pouring down the rain now (10:00 am on Tuesday 1/17/17)..

Be safe Gary and Hello to all on the site.

Larry

Hi Larry,

Just a few thoughts. Thanks very much for reporting on your kit and prep.

Glad your scope is accurate. I'm sure that will do a good job. You aren't going to want to fool with depth of field or range finding when shooting rats, do all you need is a nice clean sight pic on the lowest power. Don't have your reticle too bright. It will distract your eye. A bright flashlight on a button switch by the trigger might really help your quick sim. And, don't know if it would freeze the rats in place or not.

Don't worry about your moderator. You really couldn't have a tighter bore. 220 thousandths to 300 thousandths = 80 thousandths. Split in half, that's 40 thousandth. Consider movement when the gun fires. The pellet leaves the barrel with the gun in motion. Consider, a pellet skirt most likely expands just a bit from being swatted by the muzzle blast. Worst thing that could happen would be the pellet touching a baffle inside on the way thru. Last, as you know you have oil and rifling swarf. However; consider that a moderator that repeatedly mounted on axis, would be difficult enough to build. One that was also user serviceable, able to be disassembled, and go back together .... on axis ... perfectly; I wouldn't begin to commit to making such a thing. But I have an idea for you. I'll PM ya.

Sounds like you have a real accurate gun. Oh ... The hole of the pellet backwards is going to be larger because now you are shooting essentially a waddcutter. Nose forward, it's a ball shape. The ball pierced the paper and wedges thru. The paper tries to heal behind it. The waddcutter removes a bore sized punch.

Thanks very much for sharing Larry!
Gary

Gary,

Wow, I wish knew about 1/4 of what you do about airguns.

Gary, I leave the scope on 3 or 4 and never zoom it. I never use the lighted reticle. Like you said these are a bit on the big cross hairs which is what I like for what I using the gun for. Great ideas and help, thanks so much.

I guess I am lucky the pellet does not hit the moderator and I checked inside and the few pellets I caught with layers of Styrofoam all have nice solid but not deep rifle marks and no scratches and they are not beat up like they hit the moderator. I am not really doing any super stealth hunting where I just need a whisper. So it is OK sound wise. The crown is pretty and very clean with my best magnifying glass, each land and groove ends clean and has no broken or messed up grooves. The cut seems level, very round, and smooth. Might have got lucky.

I did clean the barrel with a cord and pieces of an old T shirt it was dirty and had grease in it but shined up nice. When I load a pellet I do not have force it in and I can see the inside and the rifling seems to have been ground down to almost zero at the breach end.

Hey Gary for the MONEY I did OK I think. No one can expect this to shoot like a $2000 pellet gun.

Thanks again,

Larry

Hi Larry,

Shoot your pellets with a bit of oil on them. Don't over clean your barrel - in your atmosphere, it will rust. Let a coating of oil in there. Clean it if the accuracy fades.

The groups you described early on show that you have a real nice gun and a great pellet.

I'd love to know how they make a skirted pellet on a homemade scale. Neat.

Keep reporting Larry. We wait for updates from "Larry In Asia!!!!"

Gary

"Interesting how your builders press everything into service. Find a way. I always admire that"

Yes, they do. I've seen quite a few pellet guns come out of the Philippines. Guy brought a couple of big bores from there to SS 1.

Lon

Hey Lon,

I have seen photos and video of some nice looking guns here. I have never seen a big bore made here in person but the photos and video look great. They make a Dump shot gun and the video on that looks wild.

I lucked out since all the .22 airguns here are made from .223 barrels I don't have to hunt and try a bunch of pellets the pellets are made for these barrels and twist they seem to work well.

Larry

Hi Larry
Good deal on the Airgun ! Looks just like Crosman 160 which happens to be one of my favorites . The pics came thru fine and the barrel size .... Hey " if the pellet fits ...shoot it "
The timing was right for a great buy and alittle TLC and there YA go .
Good luck with rodent control .

Thanks
Kurt

Thanks for sharing Larry, that was a great read!